Turbocharger Without BOV?

[Gh0sT]

don,

so just take out the bov when you get your sti and be happy lo.

your car , your money if anything happens ma...

why do you try so hard to prove that it will not harm the turbo. just go ahead and do it la, no one will stop you.

 

[SDF]

so how much more NA power can you increase on your WRX to the level that a flutter is acceptable and yet continue to build power without damaging your turbo compressor wheel (it's not called turbo fins) ? i wonder.............

theory is always a theory..

 

[Gh0sT]

Take my advice, quit boosting too high, instead increase the NA power of your engine and keep boost low.

this advice might change the turbo tuning industry forever!!!

 

[donCityZ]

don,

so just take out the bov when you get your sti and be happy lo.

your car , your money if anything happens ma...

why do you try so hard to prove that it will not harm the turbo. just go ahead and do it la, no one will stop you.

Bcos it wont harm the turbo if tuner knows what he's doing.

Yeah im gonna get flutter sound in my car. Perhaps many will laugh at me from kedai kopi "wataf.. that must be doncityz.. got flutter.. must be farkup car.. and all be wetdreaming about my car turbine splits and explode".. LOL!..

My advice actually is for turbo car owners to have a longer life turbine... i cant remember the formula.. but its something like:

BHP = NA.POWER x BOOST

LIFE = 1/BOOST

so, if u increase boost, thats normally a factor of 1/2 factor (1 or 2 bar).. but if u increase NA.POWER, thats normally 10 or 15 factor... so which one give higher BHP for turbo cars? thats right - its the NA POWER of the engine. Plus, the life also is longer.

I know, my advice probably will make car accessories seller lose one product, if everyone follows it. But Im siding with the end user... sorry to say.

---------- Post added at 02:11 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:09 AM ----------

so how much more NA power can you increase on your WRX to the level that a flutter is acceptable and yet continue to build power without damaging your turbo compressor wheel (it's not called turbo fins) ? i wonder.............

theory is always a theory..

Hehe.. i like to call turbo fins. bcos thats how it looks like to me.. plates of metal like kipas.. if wheel like my tayar mah.. :proud:

 

[Gh0sT]

so you're scared that if you do the flutter sound, pll will laugh at you from kedai kopi? and you're trying to prove your point here so people dont laugh?

my last car with turbo used to have flutter sound, at low rpm when it's not at full boost, that's cause i tighten my bov so it wont leak boost.
it ran well for 2 years and i sold off the car and its still running well.

it wont harm the turbine directly but it wont be good for the turbine in the long run.

 

[jinkl]

Ok la.. since u all so naive and in the closed mind status, I will explain how the flutter actually is not dangerous to all turbo cars. I know it is very hard for turbo car owners to accept the fact that an NA car owner giving to u... its ok... i understand wan.

Turbo flutter is not all bad.. as long as the boost pressure is not over 20+/- psi. What actually happens during a flutter is the compressed air is being bounced back and forth between the turbine and the TB butterfly flap. As you heard, the flutter sound reduces as time goes by.. why? because the pressure inside is reduced.. how? Some people, esp the so called "im a turbo sifu bcos i own a turbo car" here will say the compressed air will go through against the turbo fins and is farkup. But if you learn your Physics, you will know that anything will go thru a path of least resistance. there is NO WAY the moderately compressed air will travel back thru the fins. It just defies the laws of physics. The fins are blowing even more compressed air inside.

What actually happens, is I think most people tend to not realize about this - the bouncing compressed air that goes back and forth will exit at the easiest way - the TB butterfly flap. Yes, the flap is soft and easy to push, even by your finger.. . So everytime the bounced air return to the closed TB, the moderately compressed air will push the flap open a bit and exit through the butterfly flap, and causing the flutter sound.

Of course, if the pressure is too high, the difference of air pressure can be too huge that the air before the TB, and only for a split second, will try to push back outside the fin.. (since when throttle is released, the turbine do not spin as much pressure as it give during max spooling) and this is what caused the damage to turbos.

Why this phenomenon frequently happens in Malaysia or any place? Bcos, turbo tuners like a simple job to gain bhp for their customer's cars... ie. just increase boost. Safe time, fast money. Like I said before, flutter is not dangerous to your turbo, what is dangerous is the high boost setup. Take my advice, quit boosting too high, instead increase the NA power of your engine and keep boost low.

Understand or not? If not, like I care... LOL!.. up to you.. can continue living in a denial about this fact.. And pls go ahead with the name callings/sarcasms.. i really enjoy it...
ya ya.. turbo really need the BOV... also good la actually.. helping BOV seller to gain profit also... if u guys not buy, how to cari makan wan...

wow , dint know you would think that much, ok here it goes
when u let go ur throthle, the exhaust pulse to the turbo will reduce bringing down the boost which will lead to Vacuum , the turbo will not compressor air as the turbine wheel will not spin enuff to achieve boost, that is why the boost meters have vacuum readings

compressor air trapped between the TB and turbo will come out through the compressor housing , that is why Garrett , Holset , Borgwarners n other turbo manufacturers etc have come up with AntiSurge compressor housings like below
http://performance.vfnfiberglass.com/Shop/images/uploads/Garrett_Turbo.jpg , and this is a whole diffrent more story to tell

the air at the compressor housing inlet is not compressed, it is only atmospheric pressure no matter wht turbo it is, the compressed air will exit thru the compressor housing , the turbo no longer build boost at all when u let go the throthle fully.

if you do have a ECU Logger, log the TPS if dont believe, the TPS stays at the same reading, it doesnt open n close as you think so which means the butterfly stays.

err increase N/A Power ? N/A is Natural Aspirated, turbo is forced induction, how in the world do u increase N/A Power in a turbo, u got it wrong, i knw where u r getting, and its called increasing Volumetric Efficiency, please do not go to Nasioc n type this, the whole world would be thinking u r :stupid:

 

[donCityZ]

No u misunderstand me. I not scared ppl laugh. I will be laughing at them back for thinking my car farkup... ignorants remains ignorants i guess.

---------- Post added at 02:49 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:39 AM ----------

wow , dint know you would think that much, ok here it goes
when u let go ur throthle, the exhaust pulse to the turbo will reduce bringing down the boost which will lead to Vacuum , the turbo will not compressor air as the turbine wheel will not spin enuff to achieve boost, that is why the boost meters have vacuum readings

compressor air trapped between the TB and turbo will come out through the compressor housing , that is why Garrett , Holset , Borgwarners n other turbo manufacturers etc have come up with AntiSurge compressor housings like below
http://performance.vfnfiberglass.com/Shop/images/uploads/Garrett_Turbo.jpg , and this is a whole diffrent more story to tell

the air at the compressor housing inlet is not compressed, it is only atmospheric pressure no matter wht turbo it is, the compressed air will exit thru the compressor housing , the turbo no longer build boost at all when u let go the throthle fully.

if you do have a ECU Logger, log the TPS if dont believe, the TPS stays at the same reading, it doesnt open n close as you think so which means the butterfly stays.

err increase N/A Power ? N/A is Natural Aspirated, turbo is forced induction, how in the world do u increase N/A Power in a turbo, u got it wrong, i knw where u r getting, and its called increasing Volumetric Efficiency, please do not go to Nasioc n type this, the whole world would be thinking u r :stupid:

the vacuum created at the turbine is at the exhaust side.. not at the intake turbine.. intake turbine can never be vacuum, because it is connected directly to the intercooler-intakepipe-airfilter.

secondly, thats why i say the boost is not too high, then the air will escape thru intake flap. the turbine do not stop mah.. still turning, even at engine 2000rpm.. why the air wanna go out thru against the spinning turbine when it can just easily escape back thru the flap?

Enck Garret create those housing for super high turbo boost applications. I think u not read thru my post properly.. or.. er.. u not understand english.. (right back atcha!)

I know some of my terms are vague to you... bcos I have my own terms that i use in a normal basis. what im trying to say is the "NA power" of the engine (with the quotes). I think u know what I mean, but u just like to pick a fight.

Oh well, im done explaning anyways... u want to continue to be in ur small world, im not blaming u.. its ok, as i said, hard to accept a fact from NA car owner.. its ok... use BOV also is ok... better also if u choose the norm of modding turbos.. (go high boost).

 

[zamiex]

adoi bro donz.. thats why la u don understand what u talking about.. u buy first la turbo car and then u know why from factory the fited with stock BOV.. pls understand how turbocharger works first...
vacuum created from engine also u dunno how.. want to talk about BOV lagi? belum talk abour wesgate lagi..

>>>the vacuum created at the turbine is at the exhaust side.. not at the intake turbine.. intake turbine can never be vacuum, because it is connected directly to the intercooler-intakepipe-airfilter.

how come u say vacuum create at turbine? if that so. how come n/a cars also have vacuum? can u explain since u r the turbo sifu? try searching on the net how vacuum from engine is created.. then u post here what u get..

p/s- when u buy a turbo car, cabut your BOV and then put u hand at the airfilter... ram u pedal and u will feel air tendang at the aifilter even at low rpm.. imagine what will happen when you in boost mode.. get the picture?

 

[Jin_Jat]

This thread is not gonna stop early i guess...maybe we all should meet at a mamak stall and have roti canai together...CHILL GUYS!!

Im not saying all the veterans of turbo here is wrong but I think maybe we should let Don do what he believe is true...maybe the fluttering sound can be from something else other than the surge...I would also like to gain this knowledge...we should let him try it first...

For Doncityz,

Maybe u should try it first because there's nothing to prove here if all the common sense and logic is being rejected...I would also like to see a fluttering sound from a turbo road car...maybe i will apply on my ride too......Im not saying you are wrong in some way...maybe u do have the option and solution...so just do it and then post it here in the forum...

I want my kancil to have fluttering sound too u know~~

N/A is BETTER!!

 

[HKS-GT2835R]

compressor air trapped between the TB and turbo will come out through the compressor housing , that is why Garrett , Holset , Borgwarners n other turbo manufacturers etc have come up with AntiSurge compressor housings like below
http://performance.vfnfiberglass.com/Shop/images/uploads/Garrett_Turbo.jpg , and this is a whole diffrent more story to tell :stupid:

so THAT's what it's for hahahaha..
i thought it's got something to do with sucking more air in damnit!

 

[renxun]

BAHAHHAHAAHHAAA>>....TB flap open and close and create the flutter sound... u tink the fan that pl use to bakar satay kah...? hahahahahahahaa.....

intake turbine can never be vacuum? u crazy kah? turbine is to drive la... compressor is the intake la... wtf wid tis so call intake turbine...? u mean compressor can never enter vacuum? go buy a boost meter 1st la kiddo....the intake will not enter vacuum does not applies to street car...

the more this guy post the more funny it gets... i almost roll on the floor laughing reading his post...jin... no nid to talk about datalogs to him la..it will be alien language for him.doubt he even knw how a safc 5 button works....

dont boost too high...? muahahahahaa.... cant lah.... jinkl car so fast.... tak boleh cari makan la std boost....cannot keep up boh.....?? how how ... teach me how to upgrade my na power to smoke jin's car wid std boost.... kakakakakaakaka

 

[SDF]

amateur reading posts from Internet creating his own theory for his fantasy. The theory of creating more so called NA aka capacity is not even answered, he is just going around talking bout his flutter. How much more volumetric capacity can you squeeze from the WRX engine, which ever the spec 2.0 or 2.5 version...?

Where did the info of the compressor housing not have vacuum come about ? wow..
As i mentioned earlier about WRC cars is due to anti-lag, then YES, the turbo and the intercooler pipings will always be pressurised and in positive aka filled with boost, but never for street cars, UNLESS you run anti-lag day in day out.

Jin and the rest - STOP Replying and Trying to prove your points, don't waste ZTH's bandwidth trying to argue over non sensible points and forumners who live in self proclaimed theory worlds.

 

[SYeNi69]

Now i seriously think u need help ... i never thought it the thread was gonna be this long cause most of the answers are already in the first few pages ...

i will reset my mindset about turbochargers and how the work cause u were able to prove Jinkl wrong ... anything after this i will refer to u ... :withstupid:

p.s. maybe i should change tuner too .. bro u can tune aa ??

This is my last post here ... gud luck !!!

 

[tigger5251]

Donz, run the car with ur setup for 4 weeks, then update us :)

 

[panjang ensem]

Now i seriously think u need help ... i never thought it the thread was gonna be this long cause most of the answers are already in the first few pages ...

i will reset my mindset about turbochargers and how the work cause u were able to prove Jinkl wrong ... anything after this i will refer to u ... :withstupid:

p.s. maybe i should change tuner too .. bro u can tune aa ??

This is my last post here ... gud luck !!!

dear mr syenie, before u give all this bullshit wayang statements i suggest you get your self a engine first, u use your enjin not even for 3 months, all drag u entered u kena sapu and u wayang like hell here like u are a hero????? luckyly i know u better........get a life......and get a enjin first then talk......

 

[DanzEterna]

don...
just put on the BOV & get on with life, wat sound u like depends on the brand of BOV.

 

[tigger5251]

dear mr syenie, before u give all this bullshit wayang statements i suggest you get your self a engine first, u use your enjin not even for 3 months, all drag u entered u kena sapu and u wayang like hell here like u are a hero????? luckyly i know u better........get a life......and get a enjin first then talk......

PWN !

 

[SYeNi69]

dear mr syenie, before u give all this bullshit wayang statements i suggest you get your self a engine first, u use your enjin not even for 3 months, all drag u entered u kena sapu and u wayang like hell here like u are a hero????? luckyly i know u better........get a life......and get a enjin first then talk......

Sial nyer mamak ... tak habis2 kaco aku ... ...

 

[panjang ensem]

ekekek when else bro.......but u really a otai laa bro.....2.7bar daily drive....respek.....

 

[Jin_Jat]

2.7 bar....macam nak bikin roket pecah pon ada....