Need ICE Advice for Old System

[aboo]

Hi guys,

Need some advice on building up my ICE with my current "antique" stuff. Basically this is what I have:

Car: Iswara AB
HU: Eclipse CD3403 (CD+MP3) 45W X 2 (I think)
Front: 5" Mid Canton (heard of it?) + Alfine tweeter (Yup, Alfine, not Alpine :D)
Front Amp: 2-Ch (60W X 2) Sony XM-700A
Rear: 8" "Woofer" (Brandless) 4 Ohm + Tweeter (4 Ohm)
Rear Amp: 2-Ch (125W RMS) Coustic (Not sure of model)

History:

The rear woofer & tweeter used to be hooked up together using Pullman Set500 Xover, but I've disconnected the tweeter as I want to avoid the treble coming from behind - was trying to create front staging effect, at least it was better than previous. I also added the Alfine tweeters in front becoz I just needed more treble up front. My biggest problem now (I think) is that my 8" woofers is not playing true subwoofer ranges, vocals are also coming from it & making everything too bassy & unclean. As you can see, the only thing new about my setup is the Eclipse HU, which is about 1.5 years old.

Suggestion:

I've thought of adding these: (need some opinion)

1 subwoofer amp
1 10" subwoofer (in box)
1 5" front component (and use old amp to drive it) - trying to avoid coz might cost another RM400-500, but if have to, then no choice.

Goal:

I plan to spice up my ICE a lil bit, but I'm not sure how should I go around it. I don't wanna waste what I have although they are very old/outdated, if possible. The shops I go to mostly suggest I get whole new speaker sys. Are my stuff really that useless? I'm into SQ + SPL for band music, but also need nice clean, powerful bass for the occasional techno.

Really appreciate if you guys can help out. Sorry if this post is too long. Thanks in advance guys! Cheerio~!

 

[Beetle]

my suggestion
1. Can keep your HU and the Sony amp
2. Get a decent component set
3. Get an amp for your sub
4. Get a sub

Maybe you can set your budget about 1.5k? However, that will only be for entry level items.
:)

 

[aboo]

Thanks beetle,

I suppose I'll be driving the new comps with the Sony amp. Few more q's:

1. Looks like I'll have to ditch the old Coustic amp - can't I use some sort of Low Pass filter & use it to drive the sub?

2. Based on your suggestion, I'll be running on front comps & sub only right?

I suppose the reality is I have to replace all my speakers :D Well thats ok, at least I'm more convinced.

Thanks again.

 

[Beetle]

Oh i missed out the coustic amp
1.Actually as you said you could still use it but at 125Wrms(I assume 4 ohm mono), that won't be much for a sub.
2. Yup only comps and sub

Happy ICE-ing :)

 

[yobha]

Hi

I would suggest to used back all ur current setup 1st. 1st thing u must get all ur fundamental correct.

example :-
1) HU - CD3403
2) compset - 5" Mid Canton + Alfine tweeter
3) amp for compset - Sony XM-700A
4) sub - 8" "Woofer" *better get a matching seal box*
5) sub amp - (125W RMS) Coustic

get a good installer to properly install for u. Do ur compset comes with passive xover??

After complete all the rewiring n installation (prior correct installation n correct fundamental) then if the sound is not what u want then upgrade one by one item. Set ur ultimate budget for ur upgrade, better to audit more setup b4 decide to buy.

 

[aboo]

Thanks for all the replies guys!

yobha, I've thought of redoing my current setup, but seems like most people suggest I get new stuff. Based on what u said, I suppose its worth a try, at least I can know actually how much juice this system can actually squeeze out, b4 considering any additional stuff. And yes, the so-called comp set comes with a passive Xover (Its not really a true comp set, just match up the mid, Xover & tweeter). Some Q's:

1. Is there a specific place I should go to get my system rewired/tweaked? Heard a lot about CV Audio in Uptown, would it be suitable? Afraid when go there, they say my system too old, just buy new stuff :D.

2. Is it poss to use the coustic like a sub amp to power the 2 X 8" woofers? Currently its not playing the sub level frequencies, I dont think I can get it to do that without adding anything right?. What might be a solution?

 

[pisces23]

1) Yes, you can go and have a try at CV.
Heard a lot of good things about them.
2) I think the problem is not at the amp, but rather your tuning.
What's the LPF you set for the subs??
I suspected it was being set too high, judging from what you mentioned that you can hear vocals from them.
I am having 2x8" subs at my car running free air and they sounded right.
I just power them with only 75W rms each.
We are having an ICE TT on 24/06/2005 at Taman Desa.
Wanna drop by?? :rolleyes:

 

[cacin]

Question for you too :)

Did you use any electronic crossover or parametric EQ? Or are you just relying on your HU and amp to filter what signals goes into your speaker and sub?

What pisces23 say is correct.
The real culprit might be the Low Pass setting on your sub amp or HU. That's why you are hearing vocals from your sub. Try to rectify the problem A.S.A.P as woofer are not meant to produce high frequencies. :)

 

[aboo]

pisces23,

2. I'm not sure what is setting on my amp, I'm not sure what is the LPF setting or whether got LPF or not :D (Will check). Running free air means not using box, am I right? Btw, will try to drop by ICE TT if possible :)

cacin,

Yes, there is a Xover b4 going to sub (Pullman Set500), no eq whatsoever. Xover just has something like bass & treble. How would I know if its electronic or passive? :D Btw, I disconnected the rear tweeter just by disconnecting the connection to the Xover, the sub is still going thru the Xover.

 

[QuickShift]

NOW THIS WILL BE TOUGH.

First thing is a SQ setup will totally contradict a techno setup and your existing hardware will not make much of an in-road towards a SQ setup, but anyway...........

Check the Coustic amp as this could be the only 'Gem' there; if I'm not wrong could be the 'Power Logic' series 25W or 45W or 75W X 2 type. Use the stronger of your 2 existing amps you have to drive the front 2 speakers.

Minimum investment for hardware will be a pair of 6" big magnet bass-mids mounted over a 12mm plywood on the door; can get those ready made ones for Iswara. 1 normal $300 to $400 amp that can churn 75W rms into 4ohms X 2 will be use to drive your bass. Also get the biggest single 12" off the rack sub enclosure and drive into 2ohms. Also buy a 3-way electronic X-Over normal type and run it 2-way front/back and sub as I'm not sure your head unit is 2 or 4 pre-out. Transfer your present 5" mids to the rear and mix your tweeters using the better one in front. Least but not least, don't budget on the power cables by using at least 8G for the each amp. You should be able to have decent music to shout about with my above suggestion but your installer better be also a good tuner. Good luck.

 

[aboo]

QuickShift, thanks for the advice. Just some 'beginner' questions:

1. The 6" you said is just normal mid-bass, not comps right? Comps will be more expensive right, but will sound better as the mid-bass matches the tweeters perfectly?

2. Does it mean I need to get a 12" sub w/ enclosure? I suppose can't do anything about the 8"s right?

3. My RCA output is front (left/right) and rear (left/right). Would the 3-way electronic X-Over be the best choice?

4. Are there any suggestions on the products you mentioned? Just need something for beginners budget, but budget can be slightly extended as long as worth the money.

 

[e1fnd]

Budget?

This is my opinion la... Dun flame me :D

First of all... I would ask one big question...

What is your budget for this make-over?

Once you know how much you are willing to spend then... go and audit a few sets to the sound that you like... I used to be on the mind set of "I-want-good-sound-but-I-want-it-cheap"

You can la, but this will make you to upgrade very cepat... :D

So get a decent component.. its just one off thing.... after that you won't change the components.... you won't regret it....

I would agree wth Quickshift and Beetle but I would get a very good components... browse around and you may find good 2nd hand sets..

Just my 2 sen

 

[QuickShift]

If I talk some more audio shop owners cannot cari makan already; budget constraints means any brands will do as long as specs I mention earlier. Your electronic X-Over should be able to do the necessary 'cuts' for this setup. Your installer if he's honest will add 1 more pair of 'caps' before the front tweeters to take out the spikes. I think your ICE might turn out just nice.

 

[aboo]

e1find,

Yup, I totally agree with you also. Just looking at possibilities. I'll try to shop around for good 2nd hand stuff. Like I said, budget can be stretched if indeed its something worthy. Basically dun wanna pay a lot for something so-so.

QuickShift,

Thanks for your opinion. Will get onto some research/buying right away. ;)



Once again thanks everybody for your time & advice. Really appreciate it.