Superchargers and such

[-e f i n i-]

Sorry guys... bother u all only...
here i have some questions, but mostly on superchargers ler.. cuz i know very little about them...

-What is the most power a supercharger can give out?

-If turbines have max output and size that differ, how bout superchargers? Do they have superchargers like supercharger kit A, max output 500hp

-Do superchargers have a specific application only? Like supercharger X is created only for 2ZZGE and 2ZZGE alone, unlike turbocharger's universal application.

-If turbochargers we call it turbine, what do we call superchargers? blower?

-With very strong internals and such, is it possible for a supercharger to take 2.5 bar boost like a turbo? I read somewhere in here you guys said something bout higher boost will just make the supercharger blower explode

-By adjusting supercharger pulleys, will it increase power

-Superchargers have boost, yes, but is a BOV needed for it, just like a turbocharger needs it? And also, a supercharger needs Boost controller too right?

-Say an engine is twincharged... can i have two different boost settings for the supercharger and the turbocharger? for example, supercharger boost is set to 1.3 and turbo set to 2.5. How can i set the supercharger to kick in earlier before the turbocharger? ECU?

-Superchargers have this c.c. thingy.. like 1800cc supercharger kit for 1ZZFE and such... what is that

-Oh, and a stupid question too... my friend claimed that turbochargers can be switched on and off, but i kept telling him that theres no such thing... but is it true?
if it can be switched off, then turbo users wont worry bout fuel consumption and also if the turbocharger is off, then the car would run NA and tht makes the low comp pistons and internals not suitable for it, am i right?

----and off topic----
Can a 4AGE be fitted in a Starlet Glanza or any other Starlet models without hassle? The answer Blackhowling gave me was, with money, everything is possible.

and also... turbokits need approval from JPJ right? how do i obtain the permission to add a turbokit on a NA car? and if a car already comes with a factory turbo, i wouldnt need the permission to change the turbokit, would i? How is the procedure for the approval like? inspection and all those?
----
sorry, im constantly adding spam messages and threads to this toyota section.... please forgive me...

 

[dreamy]

haha...my opinion same like blackie...
u got $$$... wat u wan modify also can...
u got $$$... wat da inspection & approval is nothin 2 u...
in malaysia u got $$$ everythin kau tim

 

[rollakid]

i have limited knowledge on supercharges, but just wanna share a piece of my thought :D and trying to be helpful.

-What is the most power a supercharger can give out?

American dragster that produce few thousand horsepower use supercharger instead of turbocharger, so can bet they produce pretty much hp. i had seen catalog of blowers rated to give more than 1000hp each, but depend on engine.

-If turbines have max output and size that differ, how bout superchargers? Do they have superchargers like supercharger kit A, max output 500hp

I guess supercharges have rpm limit too, spin too fast, air too hot, air molecule less dence, no power, so they have limit too. small blower for smaller hp, big blower for bigger hp.

-If turbochargers we call it turbine, what do we call superchargers? blower?

turbocharger->turbine, supercharger ->supine :lol: :lol: :lol: jk.. i heard they call it blower, dunno what its real name is.

-By adjusting supercharger pulleys, will it increase power

yes, but only if you use a smaller one on the supercharger or the bigger one on the engine.

-Superchargers have boost, yes, but is a BOV needed for it, just like a turbocharger needs it? And also, a supercharger needs Boost controller too right?

bov not sure, but they have by-pass-valve, as i heard, dunno whats the difference. some supercharger i heard of can tweek the boost level, by adjusting the bypassvalve, guess it work like a wastegate :D

-Say an engine is twincharged... can i have two different boost settings for the supercharger and the turbocharger? for example, supercharger boost is set to 1.3 and turbo set to 2.5. How can i set the supercharger to kick in earlier before the turbocharger? ECU?

with a turbo that can boost 2.5bar, any supercharger would kick in before it. furthermore supercharger won't kick in, they produce boost as long as the engine is running.

-Superchargers have this c.c. thingy.. like 1800cc supercharger kit for 1ZZFE and such... what is that

saw those numbers on TRD supercharger, guess its just a fool-proof way to let ppl know which kind of engine capacity that supercharger is for.

Oh, and a stupid question too... my friend claimed that turbochargers can be switched on and off, but i kept telling him that theres no such thing... but is it true?
if it can be switched off, then turbo users wont worry bout fuel consumption and also if the turbocharger is off, then the car would run NA and tht makes the low comp pistons and internals not suitable for it, am i right?

IMO use a boost controller to switch the boost to 0psi(if thats posible), it would mean it does not have any boost and run on NA :lol: . if run like that, the power would just be like before the turbo kicks in, slugish and slow respond (like my 9.0:1 comp ratio 4K engine
hope it helps.. lol.. miss out some question cuz i really dunno also...

 

[-e f i n i-]

Thanks for you answers, dreamy and rollakid.
yeah its true... money rules the world... thats the truth, and its a painful truth too..

Anyway....
Hmm if superchargers have the same high end power like turbo, i think supercharger sure tapau lor... since supercharger will the user the advantage by boosting up first, compared to turbos that require time to build up boost.

hmm btw rolllakid, what do u mean by superchargers have rpm limit? that means u can only rev till a certain rpm before your blower blows up? :blink:

By adjusting supercharger pulleys, will it increase power

yes, but only if you use a smaller one on the supercharger or the bigger one on the engine.

hmm i dont understand that also... hmm, do u mean that, supercharger pulleys and engine cam pulley is the same, just that the size is different?

Hmm, bout that c.c. thing... that one i really dunno.. at first, what i thought was like what u said also... but then.. in KERETA magazine... there was this kembara with 4agze... he later upgraded his supercharger to 1400c.c, said to be from an Estima, but a 4AGZE is 1600c.c :blink: ... i think the owner, Gerard, is a member here too, right? seen him posting before in the Satria Supercharger thread.

 

[rollakid]

the supercharger will have a limit on how fast it can spin to pump air. blow up or not after that i dunno.

supercharger is belt driven, there will be one pulley on the supercharger and one on the engine. how fast you can make make the charger spin, just look at a mountain bike, look at its gear, the one you pedal and the one at the rear wheel.

the smaller the gear at the rear wheel (like in the supercharger), the faster the wheel spin. The gear at the pedal is like the one on your engine, the bigger it is the faster the wheel(supercharger) spin.

after see what you say on the c.c thing i also blur liau.. have to go ask other sifoo

 

[-e f i n i-]

aaaaaahh... sifu sifu please come in and clear the confusions >.<

 

[rollakid]

oh btw supercharger not always can tapau turbocharger one.. have to see engine capacity first. supercharger use engine power to pump more air, instead of using waste energy like turbocharger.

so supercharger is better on big engine with lots of torque. dun really wanna argue which one is better anymore, last time on international forum, asian imports turbo vs american supercharged muscle car.. damn.. the debate even worse then vtec vs vvtLi

 

[-e f i n i-]

Hmm so basically, the bigger the engine capacity, the better the supercharger works?
hmm, so mihgt as well get a supercharged V6 1MZFE in a MRS lolx

 

[rollakid]

i dont' realy know for sure, but the bigger the engine capacity or power the less powerloss you feel.

i also heard that engine respond can't be improve much cuz it need to spin the supercharger all the time. some say a lightened flywheel on a supercharged engine won't give much performance increase compare to NA or Turbo

 

[-e f i n i-]

sigh... after reading your post... somehow im convinced hat superchargers are still inferior compared to turbos..

but then i still wanna fulfill my dream of a twincharged car.

 

[rollakid]

good thing is supercharger can give car a quiter ride i think, mercedes Kompresor is supercharger ler.. nice what... feel like driving bigger NA engine.

twin charge too complicated ler.. last time used to reduce lag in a turbocharger, but now ball bearing turbocharger so less lag compare to last time punya old turbo. so no point twin charge unless you wan use big big siput that won't spool up until 5000rpm lar.. :lol:

not to discourage you or something, but i read from club4ag that twincharge 4ag (HKS kit) is too complicated (until you dunno how the air flow in the pipe) and cost a bomb and only give little benifit. maybe it just apply for 4ag lar.. not other engine.

 

[-e f i n i-]

hmmm but twincharge gives higher/better torque curves right?

 

[rollakid]

i dun dare say anything. all my info on twincharge is read from twin charge 4ag only.

all i read is that twincharge engine is more for show only nowadays, cuz ball bearing turbo improve spool up time and less lag. why do you need twincharge if you can have turbo spool up at 2500rpm? the supercharger will be usefull before 2500rpm only.

i would prefer sequential turbo, one big siput and one small siput. but they are still to complicated for me, how they work.. like small siput disabled and then the air flow through the big siput and such.. gah... me also confuse :(

 

[-e f i n i-]

haha its okay ler...
turbo still rocks.

 

[rollakid]

actually i like supercharge too, if i got a big capacity v8 engine lar.. :lol:

 

[ScAvEnGeR]

At this juncture I'd just like to say that what you use depends on application lo. If you travel on highways more often then I'm sure that the turbos will give you a better "feel" than the chargers but if you live in Pg like me then I'd go for the charger la... Coz roads here are narrow, short and full of turnings~! haha...

 

[shamburke]

scave,

u used s/c also ka!!!.....can we meet the next time i'm in png....

can go for soup in front of Hotel Malaya!!!!then we can share2 ideas lar...

cheers...

 

[ScAvEnGeR]

Superchargers have developed to the point that they are easy to install and simple to maintain, especially when compared to rebuilding and fine-tuning an engine.

Superchargers achieve performance gains by increasing the density of the air/fuel charge within the combustion chambers of an engine. This increase in density is achieved by forcing additional amounts of air (beyond the amount of air that normal atmospheric pressure would force into the engine) at the lowest temperature possible. CFM measures the volume of air that an engine is flowing, while MAF (mass air flow) also factors in the temperature of the air charge, since a cooler charge is more dense and therefore more powerful. So in more technical terms, supercharging increases both the volumetric efficiency of the engine and the mass air flow through the engine to produce gains in both horsepower and torque.

You can check out this page http://www.gadgetonline.com/Super.htm#Problems%20with%20the%20supercharger%20its%20self: for a lot more detailed info on the chortcomings of the superchargers. It's a more on TRD but there's also general info. Hope it helps.

 

[rollakid]

but usually supercharger kit are more expensive compare to turbo ler...

 

[Master D]

my 2 cents....

the SC setup is loads of fun but in a different league from a Turbo setup....you are talking abt low end power and top end power. If we dont include the rides used in drags and such, but focus on our local scene, Turbo will be the fastest and most practical, twincharging, hybrid and whatnot....you are looking at a shitload of money to spend and a bunch of headaches to experience as problems crop up.

I personally drive a SC GZE, loads of fun but not comparable to Turbo in anyway....1st gear and 2nd maybe.....after that...
But what can you expect from a 1.6cc engine?? Good enuff la....

And yes, $$$ solves everything! :lol: